I just don't think most bands and labels put in the time and money to make a record that is really amazing sounding. When you read about old bands mic'ing the drums for a week to get the sound they are looking for in the recording room, does that really happen anymore or is it all triggered samples for the most part...and everything is run though a computer to fix anything that isn't perfectly timed. Not a boomer but I often feel like one when talking about music production. Dynamics? I often think that older music was produced with a HiFi system in mind rather than 20 dollar earbuds fighting against a lot of background noise on the bus.

There has always been studio overdubs and fixes, but I rarely find a modern album that I'm like "yeah this just sounds amazing sonically". And while there is something to be said for a band being able to cut an album and lay down drums with Garage band and do it all on a laptop or something...most if it sound like cheap plastic to me and may as well be AI.

I'm totally putting on my boomer hat and say that most modern albums are basically unlisteneable for me because of the production. I hate those loud ass (likely digital) snares that basically drown out the rest of the music like you have the drummer right in your ear. Also most guitar sounds today feel like they barely have distortion? Like, they're compressed and blown up to the point of clipping yet when you hear them closely... not a lot of actual dist there.

On the other hand, bands putting a metric fuckton of reverb on their recordings doesn't make them "old school", it makes them sound like noisy shit.

I swear, if bands like Eternal Champion, Tanith, Hällas or Darkthrone didn't exist, I might've given up on modern productions.

Live albums could never make studio album obsolete for me since they hit two very different parts of my listening perceptIon. When I listen to Sad Wings of Destiny, I imagine swirling barrooms, gaslit alleys, and meadows populated with ethereal figures among other things. When I listen to Unleashed in the East, I just imagine five dudes on stage.

I'm just going through one of my cyclic runs through their discography - someone on here posted a long time ago that they suddenly remember that Vader exist after having forgotten about them for a while, I identify totally with that - and listened to 'The beast' yesterday.
I don't think I must have listened to it more than a couple of times since I bought it god knows when, but I really enjoyed it and thought that it is very underrated.
Granted, when you have a discography like Vader's, each album has some very tough competition, but I don't think it's a weak album at all.

That's the most popular/general opinion I've been hearing and reading since like forever. I do understand why, because Vader being Vader is not something to be mad about. But I just tend to go back to the more experimental ones the most (The Beast/Revelations/Impressions in Blood).



Nice to see that you liked that one after revisiting.

Indeed. They don't have a "bad" album per se which is quite amazing for such a long standing band.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=esDkLrZm0jU

No match

Yeah, even Revelations was a bit of a shocker for me when it came out after the primal blast of power that was Litany. But I did enjoy it, but The Beast just seemed off to me. I'm going to give it another listen while grilling dinner and see what is what. It didn't suck or anything, just felt like a letdown.

Impressions in Blood is the last relevant Vader album i think.

I don't think Vader have released a bad album in their career, which is impressive considering how long they've been going, but there's definitely peaks and dips. I agree that Litany is their best. De Profundus, Impressions in Blood, and Tibi et Igni are peaks, where The Beast and The Empire are examples of dips. But, again, I want to stress that no album is bad. Hugely awesome and consistent band no matter what you decide to listen to.

what's making me upset:

- 40-45euro records, where underground vinyl is 10 or 20 with handmade print
- reissues with normal album spread on double with boring recordings, result, album fucked (see Rage Trapped or Heathen, double album with messed up side order, ohohoh but sound is amazing!)
- any new release now needs to be bought several month before release because then it's out of price or simply not available
- some new record by my favorite band ? let's buy! oh no shit just another shitty demo/live/old shit putted on record
- 23euro for a 2 track single, really ?
- ask discogs for an opinion on music ? nothing but plastic view
- ecology in metal? mouhahaha
- hey look a new album sound is amazing, double filler with amazing sound but really boring music, great!

since "vinyl revival" everything is out of range, just like my market neighbors trying to sell me an Anthrax EP for 30 euro
I can read Decibel, see how cool it is to buy exclusive vinyl and expensive beer
and listen bands claiming being underground thrasher and so on, bullshit

plus to this I would add that when you ask more than 50euro for a drawing you're a thief, and if you ask a record you're a piece of shit - hey but thanx AI now we can avoid artist promotion, fine

and finally i would add that when complaining everyone is "ohohoh but look i"m actually a capitalist so what"
is it Taylor Swift ? is it Beyoncé ? hey no that's true metalheads

i think worst is that noone give a shit, so metal seems to be a rich people affair nowadays, just like some classical or jazzy snobism blablabli this cymbal here blablabli

I don’t find too expensive the prices my only complaint are shipping cost….

45 50 euro at month I’ll buy 4 cds of black metal

well, if i'm seing a vinyl release coming out next month for 20/25 I'll have my chance on it, if it's going for 40/45 or more, double vinyl? no thanx, keep it

now I'm living in here where metal records are very rare, shops are very rare too but when they are prices are increased because these rpices i'm talking about are from label - and collectors are asshole, some will sell rocks records for 5euro but hey this one is metal so metalheads will pay - really? to me music became luxury, thanx rich the poor can"t access

so yes, internet, shipping, taxes, for one selling 10euro in UK ends with a 38euro billing, sweet :/

Uk are fu@@@@

I’m sorry but I can’t buy from there…

Autopsy was one of the popular death metal bands I neglected back in the day and who I'm discovering anew. I've listened to a couple of tracks off Mental Funeral and Severed Survival and hesitate to make a judgement already, but why is it that I'm perfectly able to enjoy Scream Bloody Gore while these Autopsy songs sound so... stupid? I really can't find a better word, it feels like I'm listening to a parody of what death metal's critics used to say about it being talent-less noise. Is it because I didn't discover them earlier? Or have I not yet unveiled Autopsy's brilliance?

Not really bad as such, but i just think after the mid 2000's it was all a bit samey, but not as good type of albums. I wish they did rawer production.

Well i think Autopsy sound a lot filthier, and that Death always sound too nice. Most to disagree though.

Prices can be high sure. I wanted to get the last Priest album on LP but when I saw 45 bucks I just bought the CD. Maybe I'll find a used copy down the road. Vinyl pricing is all over the place, I'll see albums range from 20 bucks to 50 bucks with little rhyme or reason.

Do I give a shit? I suppose, but its way down my list of important shit to give a shit about.

Personally I think Morbid Reich, Tibi Et Igni, and Solitude are all better records. Empire is a bit of a dip but I still like it. I will agree they have no crappy albums.

Gave The Beast a listen after a long time last night and it was better than I remember, for some reason I am not a huge fan of the kick drum sound though. Still one of their least good IMO.

well, if so, not your first concern, should be not mine aswell?
this is unpopular stuff, here i'm, i know the majority love fat plastic vinyl with many details in coloring and wasted gatefold, not to forget washable cover you continue putting in plastic bag, fat aswell, and D side with ugly live or what.... if I want say something everyone is ok with, what's the interest ?

why I do here more than for pop music ? because metal is speech, criticism, discussion, telling what's not told, claiming individuals and being different, metal got the speech of independence, underground, DIY, and this is where I think speech is only business here, mostly for bands like Kreator and others - where of course I'll understand (for example) Heilung's fat album, but I will clearly enjoy (for example) last records from Sadus, Autopsy, Enforced... The last Heathen reissue is melted tracks, inversed sides, and unuseful tracks. Not all bands with double albums for years are boring, but Overkill, Kreator... What's the record from Vektor I'm playing most? the second! in most case I would trash a track or two for a more compact vinyl, and for Vektor on last LP that's for sure. In most case I'd try to make my music available at best, not only for the most confortable living beings. And if you ask why Slayer is high price compared to any unknown band, that's exactly for this reason, vinyl price is not objective. Look for books, a 250 pocket page book coast the same not depending on who's writing, right ? This is the problem to me. Sad noone care.

Before I forget, I should say that this is an excellent way of putting it - the reason why a good album structure is so important and valuable to have.

This is true, and I wonder if a lost art though in the age of streaming tracks. Though that was also probably more of the norm back in the 50's and 60's when everything seemed so 45 single orientated.

That is part of why I think Load by Metallica works so well for me. Following the mood and tone of the songs it almost plays out like a concept album in a way. Just needed to cut a couple songs.

Awesome that you gave it another chance, though.

Guess I need to revisit some of their classics again as well.

And its still a good record and worth having. Just not one of my top albums by a great death metal band.

I don't think it's any more lost than it would have ever been. Streaming just replaces the people who would've listened to the hits and skipped the other tracks anyway. And those who would've gravitated to full-album experiences still will. Same as ever. The only things that change are the modes of consumption.

Both of the Load albums are funny; I like them, but at least a third or half of those songs tend to blur into one another.

Yeah, although it's important to consider as well, at least for albums originally made for vinyl, the effect of having two or more sides to the album's pacing and structure. Using Sad Wings as an example again, the ending of 'Deceiver' and the beginning of 'Prelude' are more impactful when there's a necessary pause between them to flip the record over.

Oh yeah. Honestly never had a vinyl or done it myself - I really want to. But it was before my time. I appreciate that structure too. It's interesting to see with older albums, and again, all part of that flow that's so fucking important.

A few pages back someone posted a sterogum article about metal's "stadium class."

Anthony Fantano did an interview with him:

The Beast is a lesser album by Vader's standards, but at the same time it's better than most lesser albums by other DM stalwarts.

I suspect that it was dismissed upon its release because it's just not as intense as the albums that preceded it. It's a bit slower, a bit groovier, but it's super catchy - especially songs like 'Dark Transmission', 'I Shall Prevail', and 'The Sea Came In at Last'.

Both albums following Litany were kind of a "shock" when I first grabbed them. Its like hearing South of Heaven after Rein in Blood. You just came out of one of the most intense slabs of metal ever laid down and find things are a bit more varied and less like having a car door slammed on your skull over and over.

IMO, Autopsy perfects the strange, disassociative aspect of death metal. That pure, bonegrindingly simple extremity delivered with some kinda alien combination of ferocity and apathy; it's what musical "morbidity" is all about to me. SBG has some of that as well but overall feels a lot more polished and formulated in its approach, whereas SS/MF is just this raw, numbed emotion. I'd definitely recommend playing them as full albums instead of singling out songs though, as both have very distinct vibes throughout that weave into the experience.

Deafheaven's New Bermuda is their best album thus far and significantly better than Sunbather and OCHL in just about every way. It's a perfect listening experience from start to finish. There are no skips and no overly drawn-out ambient passages. The production is more visceral, the riffs are more memorable, the drums define and conduct the energy of the songs much more effectively, the chord changes sound more meaningful, and their use of tension and release is so much more powerful.

I saw them perform Sunbather from start to finish in December 2023. It was a great performance, but each song paled in comparison to when they played "Brought to the Water" to cap their set.

I like Sunbather, but I can't comprehend how it's so much more popular than New Bermuda. Maybe it's because it came out first and therefore made more of a splash in the metal world and drew more attention? Not a good enough reason for me. I put Sunbather on maybe once a year, but I come back to New Bermuda on a near monthly basis.

Bit of a strange opinion, or rather the analogy is very, very strained.

For the record, Revelations is almost top 5 Vader for me. And it's definitely not so different; the tracklist is ordered in such a way that maybe this affects perception to a degree; "Epitaph" takes an entire half of the song to get started (but it does), and "The Nomad" is basically "Xeper" 2.0 (and better than that song), so there is no outright barrage from the very first second. Other than that, "The Code" is bloody awesome, bouncey heavy metal that is placed perfectly to break the sequence of blasting bulldozing songs, but the closer is just not there in any aspect (not being the early version of "The End", sadly). I would legitimately put if before Litany had the slow-burning closer been better. Maybe that song marks the album for you too?

But I dunno, it just doesn't justify the South of Heaven reference at all in my view. There's that "Wolftribe"-"The Torch" sequence that's briefly interrupted, but pivots back to all out assault with "Lukewarm Race".

Hey, I just realized that by responding I may have included an unpopular opinion of my own while almost failing to notice it

Revelations isn't a South of Heaven clone or anything, just to me at the time felt like it was a more restrained album than Litany, which is just pummeling. Just felt less brutal and intense. Then The Beast hit and I was thinking that Vader had lost it.

Formed an unpopular opinion I think over the last page:

LONG LIVE NEW VADER!

I though Solitude was an excellent album. I loved it.

I don't think Dio is that good as a solo artist. Sure I like Holy Diver and Last in Line but even those don't come close to Rainbow and Sabbath.

I love most of his solo albums but I'd be lying if I said that body of work truly competes with his Rainbow/Sabbath legacy.

Honestly, Holy Diver isn't even my favorite Dio album from the 80's, let alone my favorite Dio album, and I consider Last in Line to be a bit of a front-loaded sophomore slump. I can see why people say Holy Diver is the only good album Dio made (outside of Sabbath or Rainbow), but I don't know why they group in Last in Line. It just seems undeniable that they were running on fumes and would only exacerbate on Sacred Heart before getting a well-needed shot in the arm when making Dream Evil.

Dio's solo work may not be as classic as his stuff with Rainbow or Sabbath, but he has his idiosyncrasies which can help set him apart. I don't think he'd be able to make a song like "Losing My Insanity" with Iommi or Blackmore. In fact, I think that song is an example of showing the influences he's obtained from working with both of them as it has the folksy jaunt from Blackmore's stylings and the fullness of the guitar chords from Iommi. I think moreso than any other musician who went solo after establishing themself in a band, Dio was able to carve out his own personality separate from the band(s) he came from.

At the very least, I think we can all agree that Dio's solo work is much better than Bruce Dickinson's (Oops! Said too much! Now MetalNZ is gonna throw another fit at me!)

I'd put the best of Dio's solo work up there with Rainbow but below his Sabbath work.

His and Bruce Dickinson are a wash, though I'd put AoB and TCW above any of the Dio albums by a hair.

I think this might be a relatively common opinion, regardless of the fact that people rarely say it.

Personnally, I was never the biggest fan of Dio, altogether. Don't get me wrong, I spin Rainbow's debut from time to time, I revisit Dio's Holy Diver and Sabbath's Heaven and Hell on occasions as well. It's all great music, but not music I gravitate to very often. I significantly prefer the doomier side of Black Sabbath with Ozzy. Still, there is undeniable quality in the albums I listed that involved Dio. And beyond that, the man's legacy is beyond just the music. His legacy also lies in his stage presence/persona, his high energy perfomances, and the aura of kindness and positivity that he radiated. The man also gave us "the evil eye", what we often refer to as the metal "horns" these days, and he will basically live on forever for as long as metalheads keep throwing that sign at concerts

I guess that's kind of why people don't tend to criticize his work too negatively? Like, yeah, there's a lot of his stuff I don't care much about, but I'm also clearly not the target audience for that music and I respect his body of work as a whole, regardless of the lower points in his disography.